[piano intro] - Hello, I'm Nido Qubein.

Join me on the next "Side by Side," as we discuss how our guest went from being a graphic designer to starting a salad dressing company.

We'll visit with Kissie Stroup, founder of Little Black Dressing Company.

- [Narrator] Funding for "Side by Side with Nido Qubein" is made possible by.

[upbeat music] - [Announcer] Coca-Cola Consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brands and flavors, locally.

Thanks to our teammates.

[upbeat music] We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.

- [Announcer] For 60 years, the Budd Group has been a company of excellence, providing facility services to customers, opportunities for employees and support to our communities.

The Budd Group.

Great people, smart service.

- [Announcer] Truist.

[mellow music] We're here to help people, communities and businesses thrive in North Carolina and beyond.

The commitment of our teammates makes the difference every day.

Truist.

Leaders in banking, unwavering in care.

[bright music] - Kissie Stroup, welcome to "Side by Side."

I'm fascinated by your story.

I've interviewed all kinds of people on this program.

Some of them have run multi-billion dollar companies, have tens of thousands of employees, have structures and technology that's just absolutely amazing.

And then there is you, the ultimate entrepreneur, who began a business in her kitchen, who continues to deliver the product herself, who somehow managed to get into some very important circles of influence.

And you are the backbone of America.

America was built on the backs of individuals who had an idea, sacrificed, took a risk, and then worked really hard.

So I'm really excited about talking with you.

You've started a business that is called Little Black Dressing Company.

Why Little Black Dressing Company?

- I love a play on words, which was my college major, which was graphic design and marketing.

I just thought it was fun.

That was the first thing I did in my business was the logo.

- Why not Little Purple, Little Blue, Little Yellow?

I've never had black dressing on my salad.

- Well, you have to use the Little Black Dressing as the dress for everything.

A little black dress is the dress that women wear for everything.

So Little Black Dressing is the dressing, the salad dressing for everything.

- I see.

- So that's the play on words.

- Does it look black?

- No, it does not look black.

Thank goodness.

- It's not like olive of oil and, what is the stuff that makes it black?

- Balsamic vinegar.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

- It's not that.

- I do have one of those.

I would call that brown.

- Yeah.

Why did you start a salad dressing company in the first place?

- I started a salad dressing company in 2011, mainly because of 2008.

The economy was bad, my husband allowed me to stay at home with four children.

I felt like that was the most important job I've ever done.

I would not take anything for that but, after that I figured that the kids were older and that I could do something.

And I've always been an entrepreneur.

My husband's always been supportive of that.

I made a salad dressing that everyone loved.

My grandmother started it.

It's four-generation salad dressing.

Decided to sell it after people raved over it.

- How about that?

And you started in your own kitchen?

- Started in my own kitchen.

- You literally mixed the ingredients in your kitchen.

- I did, yes.

- You literally bottled it in your kitchen?

- Uh huh.

- You literally stuck the label yourself?

- That's what we do.

It's called cottage industry.

And you still have to be safety regulated, even though you work outta your kitchen.

- And then you, to this very day, to some extent, I realize not completely, to some extent you still deliver the product.

- I sure do.

- To certain stores or certain customers.

- Mm hm.

- And one of your customers was the caterer to the US Open.

- That was fun.

- I mean, you've opened up some doors of opportunity.

- Yes, that was a big job and I was a fledgling business, probably three years into my business.

And they sent an email, wanting to know if I wanted to provide the dressing, be the official salad dressing.

- How did they know about you?

- I think they just saw it on Google.

I guess they Googled it or saw an interview.

I have no idea.

They do go to each city at each tournament that they do.

And they pick local products.

So they probably did dig around a little bit.

But they're really great about supporting local wherever they are.

And that's a great thing for us.

- Yeah, and that led to other stuff.

Pinehurst Golf Tournament.

- That was the US Open.

- Yes.

And the United States Golf Association recognized you.

How did they recognize you and why?

- I just went and did samples in 2014.

That was the first time that the US Open, or the first time that I did the US Open, in Pinehurst was 2014.

- And now how many bottles a month do you produce?

- I can do anywhere between 10 and 15,000 a month.

- 10 to 15,000 a month?

Clearly- - That's just a guess.

- I assume you're not doing that in your kitchen anymore.

- Not anymore, no.

- And pouring it in the bottle and putting the label?

- No, I have a co-packer in Henderson, North Carolina who does that.

- So you are a North Carolina lady who produced or you went to a North Carolina College, Meredith College in Raleigh.

Have they recognized you as one of the most- - [Kissie] They have.

- You know, wonderful alumni they have?

- I have.

I've done some interviews with them and I've been in their magazine.

- Yes, as you should.

And you're a North Carolina citizen, you have a company based in North Carolina, you're using products and, do I call them a bottler or a producer?

What do I call them?

- Oh, co-packer.

- Co-packer.

In North Carolina.

It's made in the USA, it's made in the Tar Heel state.

And that's something we should all be very grateful for.

- We call it made in the Carolinas.

- Made in the Carolina, yes.

What does it take to make a really great salad dressing and why is it that Little Black Dressing Company has been successful?

- I feel like fresh is best.

People are starting to understand that our food needs to be better.

I think tasty.

It has to be tasty.

It can't just be fresh and taste bad.

I really, our dressings are preservative free, they're gluten free, they're made with simple ingredients.

Everyone has different dietary ideas of what is healthy and not healthy.

We use basic ingredients and we think they taste fresh and they're healthy.

- And what makes a dressing salad healthy?

I mean, I've always been very weary of dressing salads because they're loaded with stuff.

- Right.

- How would I know when a dressing salad is really healthy?

[Kissie sighs] - I always say that dressing is best when used in a smaller amount, but it also makes the vegetables taste better.

Vegetables by themselves are not good.

So a salad dressing really enhances what you're putting it on.

I think that we can use less of Little Black Dressing salad dressings because they're pretty tasty.

- And when you say fresh, what am I supposed to understand?

You don't have a garden that you're growing stuff in and you're making the dressing.

What does fresh mean?

- Fresh is no preservatives.

We don't add any preservatives, it's not shelf stable.

It has to stay cool at all times.

It's ambient filled and it's refrigerated and it's shipped refrigerated so it stays in the refrigerator all the time.

- The ingredients come from where?

I mean, how do you start a salad dressing company?

You bring ingredients and you mix them together, obviously, right?

- Right, yeah.

- And you buy the- - Where do they come from?

- Most of the distributors.

But we use like a mayonnaise out of Columbia, South Carolina.

It's a group of brothers that make mayonnaise and it's cage-free egg, I guess chickens are free to roam, roaming chickens.

- I see.

- Yeah.

Yeah.

- I see.

You've been doing this for a long time.

- [Kissie] Feels like it.

- And you told me you literally deliver some of this product to some of your customers.

So tell me a story.

How do you do that?

I don't understand how a lady like you can get the boxes of dressing, put 'em on a truck and go down to a store and put 'em on the shelf.

- Yeah, you have to be pretty determined and pretty tough, I think.

I didn't realize that I was gonna be having to do some of these things when I started this business but, I do everything, from the cleaning to the accounting to the delivering.

I drive the box truck.

I have an 18-foot refrigerated box truck.

I drive that either with pallets or just regular cases.

And I stock stores myself.

I make deliveries in larger distribution areas.

Most of the time I'm the only woman.

I'm probably the smallest truck.

It's fun.

- And are you selling just locally in North Carolina or regionally or nationally?

- I would say Texas, north to the east.

- [Nido] Really?

- Mm hm, yeah.

- [Nido] All the way from North Carolina to Texas?

- Uh huh.

- Those are some of my account accounts.

- How did people Texas find out about you?

- It would be through a grocery chain.

- Through a chain of groceries?

- Mm hm, mm hm.

- Yes.

And that's delivered to them and they obviously drop them.

- Through a distributor.

So sometimes I don't even know what stores it's in.

- So, you majored in graphic design.

You chose to be an entrepreneur.

How did you learn to be an entrepreneur?

Was it all trial and error?

Did you read books?

Did you attend seminars?

Where did you get that genre of thought about, I think I can start a business, I think I can make it work.

And I assume the business is profitable?

- Uh huh.

- I assume you're making some money out of it?

- Yes.

- You know, how did you, where did you get all that from?

- Did you watch somebody and you said, "Hmm, I can do that?"

- That's a really great question.

'cause I knew nothing.

I knew nothing of business.

I was an art major, marketing graphic design major.

So we didn't learn a lot of that in college.

I started with a logo, like I said.

I really should have started with a business plan.

But I did get to that.

- Yes.

- Yeah.

I just learned through trial and error.

And I worked with a really fine gentleman at UNC Chapel Hill, Kenan-Flagler School.

He was part of score, which is retired executives, and he helped me a lot.

- [Nido] You have to think about- - And he passed away in October.

- Oh yeah, well.

- Mm hm.

- He must be smiling upon you knowing that you have put those ideas to work.

- Great guy.

- Where did you get the money from?

Did you borrow money, did you go to some bank and sold them on your idea?

Did you go to a small, you know, a federal agency like US Small Business?

How did you do that?

Or did you find an investor?

- I didn't wanna start owing a bunch of money.

I didn't think that was fair to the family.

I wanted to start a business but not put the burden on my husband for having to fill the shoes financially.

So I started with $2,500.

And that's it.

- $2,500.

- That was it, mm hm.

- I started my business way back before you with $500.

I really understand.

- You did?

- You know, I'm intrigued by you because I came outta college and started my first business and worked 17 hours a day, and invested all the money I had, $500.

I think people who have never done that don't understand the complexity of it, don't understand the risk of it, don't understand the enormous amount of hard work that you have to put in to make it work.

And then you hope it succeeds.

And sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.

Why weren't you on, what is it called?

Shark Tank.

- Shark Tank is, that scares me.

- Yes.

- Yeah.

- They can be tough on there.

- They can be tough.

- Yeah.

- They can be quite mean.

I really don't like to air my laundry on national TV.

They don't like food businesses because I'll have to say, 97% of food businesses fail.

And that was before Covid, so I can imagine it's higher now.

They typically don't invest in a food business because it's- - And you don't want them to be your partners necessarily.

- Not really, no.

- Heretofore you've taken no partners.

- Right.

- Why haven't you?

- I enjoy doing it by myself.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

I guess maybe I'm just, I don't like to take instruction.

Is that bad?

[Nido laughing] - Well, but you could have had some silent partners.

I need a lot of instruction, really.

- You know?

Yeah.

You could have taken some silent investor, which would've multiplied your business and made it bigger.

- It could have.

You're right.

Yeah, I just didn't feel the need to do that.

I really enjoy what I do now.

I have four children, five grandchildren.

I want to be able to see them.

So making it work my way is what I wanted to do.

- But you have to produce a certain number of bottles every month.

I mean, that's a business you have to deliver on.

- [Kissie] Right.

So you can't just say, "Ah, I think I'll just take the next two months off, go to the beach."

- No, unfortunately you can't.

But you can do flexible time throughout the week.

I've learned how to work just as hard but smarter.

- And the people in Henderson who are making, who co-producing this with you, will you go meet with them?

How do you make sure that an outside supplier adheres to the standards that you want?

- We really need to stay on top of that all the time.

I feel like I work for them as much as I work for myself.

For me, my business is relational.

I love the people that I work with, I love my customers.

I love the, you know, whoever, all of the bottlers that are in there.

I really enjoy getting to know people.

That seems to be the most important part to me.

I feel like family with most of them.

I feel like I'm as much an employee at the co-packer as they are.

So I'm there a lot.

I'm there a couple times a month.

- What about research and development?

Who does that?

- I have a little test kitchen still here in High Point.

Do a lot there myself.

And they have a larger R&D Department.

So we work together.

We're working on a shelf-stable line now.

- What does that mean?

- That means that it will have- - You said that it's shelf stable?

- Stable, yeah.

Mine is refrigerated so that's not shelf stable.

Shelf stable would just be where you would find it in a regular salad dressing shelf.

It's probably less expensive.

I'm gonna try to make it as tasty and not use the preservatives that the other ones use.

- I see.

- We're working on that.

- And it lasts longer on the shelf?

- It'll last a little bit longer.

- But your product now is inside of a refrigerator.

- It is.

It's in the produce department.

- Which makes difficult.

How do you deliver that product?

- In a refrigerated cooler or truck.

- I see.

- Yeah.

- It has to be refrigerated at all times?

- At all times.

- What is the life span of a salad dressing bottle?

- Believe it or not, for a fresh product, it's unusual because mine are 11 to 13 months.

That's a lot.

- Really?

- I know.

- Even though it has no preservatives in it?

- Mm hm.

As long as it stays refrigerated.

- It's gonna go a whole year?

- It goes a whole year.

- How much does a bottle of Little Black Dressing Company sell for at retail?

- Anywhere between 4.99 and 6.99.

- And how does that compare with other salad dressings?

- It is probably about the same as other fresh, we call it more specialty dressings, more expensive than the shelf-stable dressings.

Or maybe some of the larger national brands.

- But the shelf-stable dressing would sell for how much?

- Probably 3.99.

- I see.

- Yep.

2.29 to 3.99.

- So you're gonna appeal to someone who's more health oriented?

- They have to be educated on that section of the grocery store, yes.

- So I assume you're putting your product in some stores that cater to people who care about?

- Different stores have different types of customers and some customers enjoy the perimeter of the store better because it's healthier.

- You define the perimeter as what?

As the- - All the fresh.

- You understand I'm not a guy who- - Yeah, yeah, I know.

- Who knows a lot about that.

The inside of the grocery store is dry goods, it's.

- Yes.

- Yep.

So all the perimeter is the fresh stuff.

- Is the fresh, refrigerated stuff?

- [Kissie] Yes.

- And frozen stuff?

- Yep.

And that shelf space is way more expensive.

- I see.

What are your plans for the future, Kissie?

- I would like to continue to grow this.

- What do you hope to do with this company?

- I would like to keep going.

I love where I am right now.

I probably should add some other big accounts.

Like I said, I was gonna work on the shelf stable, just to add that nuance to the business.

- And if you were speaking to a group of young people who are just young outta college, or just a few years outta college, and they would like to be an entrepreneur, they'd like to start a business, you would say to them, "Here are the three things that you really should know to start a business," what would those be?

- Start your business plan first.

- [Nido] Have a business plan.

- I learned that.

- You did not have that.

- I did not do that.

No, I did the fun stuff first.

- You did it in reverse.

- That's the best thing to do.

- So you're saying- - Figure the money out.

- So you're saying you made some mistakes early on.

- Absolutely, yes.

- I see.

So have a business plan.

- Have a business plan, talk to people who are already doing it.

- Ah.

- Go to people who are already- - Have some mentors, some people who can- - Yeah.

Find out what the success rate is, find out what the challenges are, the failures.

- Did I hear you that your type of product, the food business, is 97% failure rate?

- That's what I heard before Covid.

Yeah, so I can imagine it's worse now.

- [Nido] Really?

- Most food businesses, me selling a retail product or a restaurant, I think that's even higher.

Yeah, it's challenging.

- Wow.

And then what would be the third thing?

So have a business plan, talk to some people who've been there.

And what?

- Talk to yourself about whether you're up for the challenge.

- [Nido] Work hard, commit.

- It is a 24/7, you know.

If you're not actually doing things in the business, you're laying around thinking about it.

- Yeah.

- Yep.

And you know that.

- And you are 24/7.

Almost any entrepreneur I've ever spoken with, or really any CEO of any kind of business would tell you, you know, it's 24 7 job.

You know, if they're go on a walk, they'll be thinking about it.

If they're going to sleep, that's kind of thinking about it.

It's always in your consciousness.

What can I do, what can I do better?

How do I do it better?

What mistake did I make and so on.

Who can I call on, et cetera.

The fascinating part about you, is that many people start businesses, right?

So, you know, Daniel Lubetzsky started Kind snacks and built it into a huge business, which he has sold for billions of dollars, by the way.

Or sold half of it for billions of dollars.

I know somebody in North Carolina who has hot sauce.

They make hot sauce.

And I don't know the size of the business, but very much like you, an entrepreneur had an idea and so on.

I know a lot of people in cosmetics who started a very small way and build a cosmetics company.

You've chosen to remain, if not a solo entrepreneur, certainly by definition, I want to be this size.

I don't want to be the big company with a lot of overhead and a lot of employees and a lot of that.

And you think that works for you?

And that's what makes America so great is that you can have people who think that way, you can have people who wanna build a bigger business.

It doesn't matter.

It all somehow comes out in the wash. What would you say to someone if they ask you, "What are some mistakes you made?"

You wanna talk about business plan, but beyond that, what are some errors you made that if you had to do this business again, besides the business plan, what would you do differently?

- Probably start with the shelf-stable salad dressing first.

- [Nido] Really?

- Yes.

- Why is that?

- Refrigerated shipping is very expensive.

Safety, regulatory wise, it's more difficult.

I'm having to backtrack now and try to catch up to the shelf stable.

- [Nido] I see.

- While take care of the refrigerated and figure out how I brand both of them together.

So that's, I wish I had started with that a long time ago.

So I'm having to do that now.

- Shipping is easier, the.

- Shipping's easier, the shelf life is longer, mm hm.

- [Nido] All of that.

- Right.

- Yeah, yeah.

I understand.

That's very interesting.

Who regulates a business like yours?

Is there a government agency?

- North Carolina Department of Agriculture.

And the FDA.

- And how do they do it?

- They send someone every year.

Every year they regulate and we have to have a third-party audit.

The documentation is massive.

Second-most regulated industry in the United States is food for human and animal consumption.

- [Nido] Really?

What's the first?

- Flammable liquids.

- Flammable liquids.

- Third is pharmaceuticals.

So that tells you where we are.

- Yeah.

- Yeah.

- What is flammable liquid?

What would that?

- Gasoline?

- Oh, I see.

- I guess.

- I see.

Yeah, I see.

So flammable liquids and then- - Food.

- Food - For animals, and humans.

- For animals and humans.

Animals don't eat any salad dressing I take it, so.

- Probably not, but we want them to be healthy.

- Yes, yes.

Yes, I understand.

And so as you look towards the future, what do you dream about?

Besides going into the, you know, the shelf- - Yeah.

- Product.

- I really love my life.

I'm really happy where I am.

- You're married, you have children, you have grandchildren.

- Grandchildren.

- Do you play some sports, right?

- I do, yes.

I get to do that.

Tennis and pickleball.

- Tennis and pickleball.

- Uh huh.

I enjoy that.

- Do you like pickleball?

- That's a really good question 'cause I've played tennis all my life.

- That's a big deal in America now.

- I know.

- It's noisy.

- And I never thought I'd do it.

- It's very noisy.

- It is very noisy.

But it's so much fun.

- Why is it?

- I think it's a little more social than tennis.

It's a little easier, so if you played tennis beforehand and you play pickleball next, you're a little better at it.

- [Nido] I see.

- It's a lot more recreational.

There's a lot less drama, too.

- And easier to learn how to do it.

- Easier to learn, yeah.

- You see a lot of older people do it.

- Yeah, I think it's good for our country.

Well, it's actually good for the world.

Because people can do a little exercise.

- So, Little Black Dressing Company was begun because your grandmother, grandmother, right?

- My nana, mm hm.

- Your nana was doing that and you liked it and so on.

Is she still living?

- She's not, she's been passed away.

- Did she know that you started the business?

- She did, yes.

- And what did she think about?

- She actually saw the first US Open so she was excited about that.

- She did?

- She's had her picture in the paper with me before.

- Really?

- Mm hm.

- And what did she think about when you started the business?

- She was excited, yeah.

- And did she agree with you about the quality of the product and?

- Absolutely, yes.

- She liked it?

- She liked it.

- [Nido] She liked the product?

- Yeah.

= So your children, how many children do you have?

- Four.

- Four.

And what do you want 'em to do?

Any of them want to be in the business with you?

- No.

I tried to give it to 'em.

- They don't wanna be in the business?

- No.

They helped in high school and college, but they've moved on to doing their own thing, so.

Maybe somebody will come back around and want it.

- Maybe they saw how tough the business is, how hard you work.

- They saw that.

Yes, they did.

- And decided they'll do their own schtick somewhere.

- They saw me doing a lot of stuff that I didn't even know I would be doing, in the middle of the night.

- When you look at our state of North Carolina, you see a lot of big companies moving to the state.

But you see a lot of entrepreneurial spirit in North Carolina, too.

Our state, you know, from coast to mountains, filled with people who have an idea and work hard and start the idea and make it work.

Do you belong to any groups?

Do you talk to some of these people?

Do you have a circle of influence that you chat with?

And what is it that you see in North Carolina that excites you about the future?

Do your children live in North Carolina?

- They do.

- And so when you look at your children, grandchildren, you know, you must be high on North Carolina.

And why is that?

As a business person, why is that?

- North Carolina really is very supportive.

Our AG, Department of Agriculture, at least for the food industry, has been super helpful.

They start businesses with us all the time.

We also have another association.

It's the North Carolina Specialty Food Association, which is part of a countrywide specialty food association.

I think it's probably one of the best associations, food associations in the country.

Other states come to us and ask for advice, 'cause we have a big membership and we do a lot.

- So that gives you a lot of support, too?

- [Kissie] Mm hm, yep.

- So I'm gonna end this program as I started.

You're fascinating because you're small business, but you are diligent and committed and determined.

And for that, I honor you and thank you for being with me today.

- Thank you.

[gentle music] [bright music] - [Narrator] Funding for "Side by Side with Nido Qubein" is made possible by.

[upbeat music] - [Announcer] Coca-Cola Consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brand and flavors, locally, thanks to our teammates.

[upbeat music] We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.

- [Announcer] For 60 years, the Budd Group has been a company of excellence, providing facility services to customers, opportunities for employees, and support to our communities.

[gentle piano music] The Budd Group.

Great people, smart service.

- [Announcer] Truist.

[bright music] We're here to help people, communities and businesses thrive in North Carolina and beyond.

The commitment of our teammates makes the difference every day.

Truist.

Leaders in banking, unwavering in care.