[soft music] - [Announcer] "Shaped by Sound" is a co-production of PBS North Carolina and the Department of Natural and Cultural Resources.

The series is presented by Come Hear North Carolina.

- [James] I'm James Mieczkowski, and this is "Shaped by Sound."

Superchunk is an indie rock institution within the Triangle music scene.

Back in 1989, two of their members founded the label Merge Records to release and promote the band's own music.

And over the years, Merge became very successful and Superchunk did too.

But despite that growth in time, their trademark frenetic energy is at the center of each show.

Today on "Shape by Sound," performing for us during a break from their latest world tour and in conversation with me, Superchunk.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ If it weren't for those laughter guns you're riding on ♪ ♪ You would not exist ♪ ♪ If it weren't for the flashlight shining in my face ♪ ♪ Maybe I could resist ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ When all our bones and muscles hurt ♪ ♪ What's so funny about that ♪ ♪ When you remember a saying you can't relearn ♪ ♪ What's so funny about that ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough ♪ ♪ And I know that you are never wrong ♪ ♪ I know that you are never wrong ♪ ♪ I was not weak, the drink was strong ♪ ♪ I know that you are never wrong ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ ♪ I think I'm hyper enough as it is ♪ [upbeat rock music] - Mac, Jim from Superchunk, thank you so much for being on "Shaped by Sound."

- Thank you, thank you.

- How's it going?

- It's going well.

Now, you both live in Durham or Chapel Hill?

- I live in Durham.

- Yeah.

- I live in Chapel Hill.

- Yeah.

- My family moved to Durham in 1981.

- I met Mac in college.

I would go to New York to visit my friend, who was his roommate or lived on the same floor in the dorm, and that's how we became friends.

- When Mac brought you down, like, what was drawing you in?

Like, what was so exciting for you?

- My first time coming down to Chapel Hill, I was just like, "Wow, this is where I want to be."

I mean, it was just the availability and the access of music, of the music scene.

I mean, there were clubs, there was a street where people were walking on it, you know, going places.

You know, and availability of, you know, the culture that resonated with me by reading about it in fanzines and books and hearing about it.

But it always just seemed to be kind of like this mythical place that just didn't really exist.

And then, you know, getting out of the car on Franklin Street in 1985 or something, it was, you know, it was eyeopening.

- Hmm.

What made you want to bring him down here?

- Oh, he had nothing to, he had no say in the matter.

We were a big group of people.

- Yeah, yeah.

It was sort of, again, we all met up north in New York and Connecticut, but for me at least, staying in New York after college wasn't really an option in terms of whatever kind of job I could have gotten at that point.

And I was part of this music scene down here.

I wanted to come back and play music and, you know, be around my friends and live here.

So you could play music in your living room and, or in your garage or whatever.

And yeah, it was just, it was a easy place to be.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ I still have briars in my clothes ♪ ♪ Did I lay you down in those ♪ ♪ The names on the stones were all erased ♪ ♪ And I thought it was you that I had chased ♪ ♪ Driveway to driveway drunk ♪ ♪ I don't remember this too well ♪ ♪ I'm glad I have the scrapes to prove ♪ ♪ Prove it was me who fell ♪ ♪ And the names were all we knew ♪ ♪ And the names were all erased ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ From stage to stage we flew ♪ ♪ A drink in every hand ♪ ♪ My hand on your heart had been replaced ♪ ♪ And I thought it was you that I had chased ♪ ♪ Driveway to driveway drunk ♪ ♪ I don't remember this too well ♪ ♪ I'm glad I have the scrapes to prove ♪ ♪ Prove it was me who fell ♪ ♪ And the names were all we knew ♪ ♪ And the names were all erased ♪ [upbeat rock music] [upbeat rock music] - So, Mac, obviously you're co-owner of Merge Records, just turned 35.

So you have sort of a unique perspective on the music industry as a musician and as an co-owner of a label.

As the methods of delivery for music has sort of evolved over time, how have you as artists sort of changed with it?

- I don't know that we've really changed how, like what we do in response to how music is consumed.

I feel lucky that we can still tour and people will come see us.

And I think the fact is that a lot of people who come see us have been coming to see us for a long time.

It's amazing when we have new fans, I love that.

It's great to see young people in our crowds.

That's pretty wild.

It's awesome.

And I think that for the most part, I think that the internet ruined everything.

But I think that one thing that's interesting is that, you know, when I think about the bands that I wanted to go see when I was that age, they were mostly, you know, people that were my age are like slightly older, a little bit older.

I wasn't trying to go see a lot of bands that were putting out records before I was born.

And so the fact that people can discover things now, and we see this with our own kids, discover things now that came out so long ago but they don't see, because of the way music is presented in current like formats, they don't necessarily draw those same lines between like what's super, like, they don't see old stuff as necessarily like, "Oh, like that's old dusty records that are just been in my parents' shelf or whatever.

Like, I don't need to listen to that."

Like, they kind of approach things in a much more egalitarian way, for lack of a better word, in the sense of like, what's old, what's new.

And if they like it, they like it.

And to me that's, that's really cool.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ In the crowd ♪ ♪ The crowd spreads out ♪ ♪ Takes out its glasses ♪ ♪ And they'd swear ♪ ♪ They pull out arrows from God knows where ♪ ♪ The fires in full ♪ ♪ They form a net ♪ ♪ They drain their cups ♪ ♪ And wait expectantly for their heroes to blow up ♪ ♪ She pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Said that's what happens when you're learning to fly ♪ ♪ Pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Said that's what happens when you're learning to fly ♪ ♪ Said those wings are just a disguise ♪ ♪ And you cannot make me cry ♪ ♪ Pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Said that's what happens ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ Was it worth the wait ♪ ♪ Is that the wall where you marked off the date ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ With the wings ♪ ♪ Made of wax ♪ ♪ Made of water ♪ ♪ He was too dumb to accept the offer ♪ ♪ He was too smart ♪ ♪ To strap on into the leather ♪ ♪ Fire it up ♪ ♪ Pull out the feathers, one by one ♪ ♪ As he got closer to the sun ♪ ♪ She pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Said that's what happens when you're learning to fly ♪ ♪ Pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Said that's what happens when you're learning to fly ♪ ♪ Said those wings are just a disguise ♪ ♪ And you cannot make me cry ♪ ♪ Pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ Pointed at the black cloud in the sky ♪ ♪ She said with you it is no use ♪ ♪ Why do you try ♪ ♪ She said with you it is no use ♪ ♪ Why do you ♪ [upbeat rock music] - Within this show, it's called "Shaped by Sound," and we kind of want to identify, you know, how music can shape us as people, as communities, and as, you know, a state.

In what ways do you believe that you are shaped by sound?

- I'm always amazed that, you know, because I think talking to people who are lucky enough to be playing music in a band as something that we do, you know, that we can still do, that's one thing.

But I'm always amazed when I meet people and talk to people who sound and music is something that has nothing to do with their job or like what they do all day or like a large part of their life, but it's this other thing that's like, "Oh, like this is my, like retreat or this is a thing that kind of like saves me from all this other stuff I'm dealing with every day in my life."

And, you know, so to me, that is a very powerful aspect of music or connection to bands or music scenes.

The people that aren't trying to do it to make a living or because they feel like a calling to like play guitar or something, it's just that like, it gives them something that they don't have in the rest of their life.

- And it's bigger than entertainment.

- Yeah.

- It's not just, you know, something to kill time or pass a pleasant hour.

It actually is some sort of kind of, I don't know.

I mean, I wouldn't say religious, but it fills some sort of space in other people's lives.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ I see you slit your wrist as big as your fist ♪ ♪ You take a slow sharp stick and run it through you ♪ ♪ 'Cause if it sounds as good as the action just like a kiss ♪ ♪ Well, you hesitate and you waste ♪ ♪ Why don't you move ♪ ♪ Hit the gas straight on ♪ ♪ Run through the lights, run through the trees ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ You say what you wanna say ♪ ♪ Get to the point, you're getting to me ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ Whoa ♪ ♪ You can graze ahead and go home happy ♪ ♪ Yeah, it's your free time in the back of your skull ♪ ♪ And that's fine for now, but what comes after ♪ ♪ You've been sucking wind so long, it makes you feel full ♪ ♪ Hit the gas straight on ♪ ♪ Run through the lights, run through the trees ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ You say what you wanna say ♪ ♪ Get to the point, you're getting to me ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Come on ♪ [upbeat rock music] ♪ You've been sucking wind so long ♪ ♪ You've been sucking wind so long ♪ ♪ You've been sucking wind so long ♪ ♪ You've been sucking wind so long ♪ ♪ Hit the gas straight on ♪ ♪ Run through the lights, run through the trees ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ You say what you wanna say ♪ ♪ Get to the point, you're getting to me ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Skip steps one and three ♪ ♪ Yeah ♪ [upbeat rock music] - We're not in a rush to put out a new record 'cause then we'll start touring again.

So just gonna, you know, work on these new songs and make sure that the next album is something that we want it to be.

And then hopefully maybe towards the end of 2025, have a new record.

- And for us, that's, you know, that's pretty an extensive future mapped out 'cause we generally don't, you know, the question was, what are you gonna do in the future?

And we are pretty, you know, take each day as it comes, you know.

So we don't, we never have a grand master plan.

- Has that always been the approach as well?

- Yeah, and we've never like sat down and had, you know, fill out a vision board or anything like that.

- I've tried to get Jim to fill out a vision board so many times and he's never taken.

- Nope.

- So.

- I mean, you know, we're all in this together, but who knows what the future can bring.

- Yeah.

Mac, how many vision boards do you have?

- I mean, I've got a closet full- - [James] And you save them?

- But I save them.

- Yeah.

- I could just take a picture and then try erase, but I just get a new one, yeah.

- Might be nice to revisit some visual vision boards, right?

- Sure, sure.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ Brace me, brace me ♪ ♪ Stand me up and race me ♪ ♪ You found the sun ♪ ♪ While I'm collapsing under the shade tree ♪ ♪ Staring at your flowers printed on your floor ♪ ♪ Oh, well, I've been down here before ♪ ♪ Well, you caught me singing ♪ ♪ Asked me to meet you down at low F ♪ ♪ And I missed the question ♪ ♪ But you have my answer ♪ ♪ Yes, yes ♪ ♪ Canvas, rubber ♪ ♪ Paper and twine ♪ ♪ What will keep us upright ♪ ♪ Well, I'm inclined to answer ♪ ♪ None of the above ♪ ♪ And at the risk of sounding obvious ♪ ♪ And oblivious of ♪ ♪ Oh, a thousand other answers ♪ ♪ Do you think the answer is love ♪ ♪ And you caught me singing ♪ ♪ Asked to meet you down at low F ♪ ♪ And I heard the question ♪ ♪ And you have my answer ♪ ♪ Yes, yes ♪ [upbeat rock music] [upbeat rock music] ♪ Well, you caught me singing ♪ ♪ Oh, can you meet me down at low F ♪ ♪ And I heard the question this time ♪ ♪ And you have my answer ♪ ♪ Yes, yes ♪ ♪ And you caught me humming ♪ ♪ Oh, can I meet you down at low F ♪ ♪ And you have my answer ♪ ♪ And you have it to my last breath ♪ ♪ Yes, yes, yes ♪ [upbeat rock music] - [James] Thanks for joining us on "Shape by Sound."

If you'd like to hear the songs we discuss today, you can find them over on our website at pbsnc.org/ShapedbySound, or you can find them on YouTube.

[upbeat rock music] ♪ Walking up first in the sun ♪ ♪ Avoiding everyone ♪ ♪ When you come high into view ♪ ♪ Over Bellevue ♪ ♪ And those bricks begin to hum ♪ ♪ Glass vibrates with the tone ♪ ♪ You're nothing but alone ♪ ♪ United nations glows with light ♪ ♪ And you're up all night ♪ ♪ This is no one's home ♪ ♪ Sensing one way free ♪ ♪ These canyons killing me ♪ ♪ Well, you dive then lift away ♪ ♪ On the dying day ♪ ♪ Falling from my feet ♪ - [Announcer] "Shaped by Sound" is a co-production of PBS North Carolina and the Department of Natural and Cultural Resources.

The series is presented by Come Hear North Carolina.